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Thread: Too small?

  1. #1
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    Default Too small?

    Would you take this bear? Are they worth taking this small? It's not a trophy but it's healthy looking and a good size to deal with.
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    That's pretty small. Remember, legally, they must be at least 50 lbs in weight.
    It might weigh that much, but hard for me to say. It would look even smaller in the back of your truck. I'd pass.

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    I don't think that bear would discriminate against eating fawns. I would shoot that bear for sure.

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    One of the bears I shot was a lot smaller than I thought it was when I saw it from a long ways off. Not illegal but certainly nothing to be proud of. I would not shoot that bear. I draw the line at 150-200 pounds but that is just my opinion. I know some guys shoot really small hogs so maybe there is no difference as long as it is legal.

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    If you have to ask, it's probably too small. It's liking asking your friends at the bar if she's too big....probably best to pass

    If there's one small bear there's probably bigger close by.

    Cheers,
    M.V.

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    It looks pretty lean, not a lot of fat on It, closing day of bear season I would be really weighing It out In my mind. But for now I think I would also pass.

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    Your trail cam is likely to get stolen unless it is very well camouflaged, does not have a red flash or is on private land?
    Just trying to help, hope you get a bear. As far as that one being to small, it's up you (provided it's legal).
    There wasn't enough room in the boat.

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    Way too small...hold out for a rug, not a doormat!

    Human beings only have two ways to deal with one another: reason and force. Force has no place as a valid method of social interaction, and the only thing that removes force from the menu is the personal firearm, as paradoxical as it may sound to some.

    The U.S. city with the most restrictive gun laws in the nation, Washington, D.C., has the highest murder rate at 24 per 100,000. The state with the most unrestrictive gun regulations, Vermont, has the lowest murder rate at 0.48 per 100,000.


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    Quote Originally Posted by Bankrunner View Post
    Your trail cam is likely to get stolen unless it is very well camouflaged, does not have a red flash or is on private land?
    Just trying to help, hope you get a bear. As far as that one being to small, it's up you (provided it's legal).
    Is it the road that makes you think my camera is vulnerable? It is on semi private land, no red flash, and I only left it there for a day. There's very little traffic on that portion of the road, but I do worry about the cams when I put them out. I do try to hide them as much as I can. I only lock them up if they're obvious.
    I appreciate your thoughts.

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    Yah, it was the road. Knock on wood, I haven't lost any, (to people, i did lose one to a bear) but i worry as well.
    There wasn't enough room in the boat.

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    Your tag, if you are up to it-shoot that sucker!
    Any day in the outdoors is a damn good day.

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    Quote Originally Posted by vogel002 View Post
    If you have to ask, it's probably too small. It's liking asking your friends at the bar if she's too big....probably best to pass
    HaHA!!! Well said my friend... well said. That's kinda like when your friend replies back to you "That? Hell, I wouldn't even **ck her with your **ck! Ew!"
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    I want a bear badly...as payback for my wrist that got shattered while heading into a spot to hunt for them. But I'd have to say... pretty sure even I would pass on that bear right there.
    "None of us was born knowing ANY of this! If someone else can do it, YOU can TOO!" - TheGDog
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    Small to be sure, probably not 50lbs - so I'd pass. Having said that, what you shoot, within the law, is a personal decision every hunter makes on they're own. Also, there probably won't be another bear nearby, bears don't travel in herds (like deer), and with the exception of a sow with cubs (which are illegal kills), or bait site in Canada, bears are solitary and require a lot of space - like miles. Outside of a zoo, you'd be hard-pressed to find any bear this age with fat on it, just too young - does look healthy though -nice coat. Looks like this little one has been pushed down to a lower elevation (by another bear, or bears) and is simply tying to survive.

    What is semi-private land....?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Wild1 View Post
    Small to be sure, probably not 50lbs - so I'd pass. Having said that, what you shoot, within the law, is a personal decision every hunter makes on they're own. Also, there probably won't be another bear nearby, bears don't travel in herds (like deer), and with the exception of a sow with cubs (which are illegal kills), or bait site in Canada, bears are solitary and require a lot of space - like miles. Outside of a zoo, you'd be hard-pressed to find any bear this age with fat on it, just too young - does look healthy though -nice coat. Looks like this little one has been pushed down to a lower elevation (by another bear, or bears) and is simply tying to survive.

    What is semi-private land....?
    Hey, Wild1. You may not know that even though bears are solitary, their home ranges can overlap considerably when habitat productivity is high (especially males, but females, too). This was shown through many telemetry studies some time ago.
    In my own observation, I've discovered areas in October with at least a dozen uniquely identifiable bears traveling the same route in the same week, many on multiple separate days. It happens more than you might think. The trick is finding areas with abundant food resources.

    As a side-note, I'd also wonder if this young bear has even established its home range yet.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Wild1 View Post
    Small to be sure, probably not 50lbs - so I'd pass. Having said that, what you shoot, within the law, is a personal decision every hunter makes on they're own. Also, there probably won't be another bear nearby, bears don't travel in herds (like deer), and with the exception of a sow with cubs (which are illegal kills), or bait site in Canada, bears are solitary and require a lot of space - like miles. Outside of a zoo, you'd be hard-pressed to find any bear this age with fat on it, just too young - does look healthy though -nice coat. Looks like this little one has been pushed down to a lower elevation (by another bear, or bears) and is simply tying to survive.

    What is semi-private land....?
    I saw four bears within 2 miles of one another in Utah...clearly different sizes and colors. And that was in the span of 3 hrs.
    Human beings only have two ways to deal with one another: reason and force. Force has no place as a valid method of social interaction, and the only thing that removes force from the menu is the personal firearm, as paradoxical as it may sound to some.

    The U.S. city with the most restrictive gun laws in the nation, Washington, D.C., has the highest murder rate at 24 per 100,000. The state with the most unrestrictive gun regulations, Vermont, has the lowest murder rate at 0.48 per 100,000.


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    And I've seen two bears, 1st maybe 250 Lbs all-black and second possibly 350 Lbs cinnamon within 1.25 miles of each other within a timespan of maybe 2hrs, right here in Angeles Nat'l Forest.

    I'm pretty certain it had to do with presence of ripening choke-cherries and the nice breeze that blew thru that area on that hot Summer day.
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    dthome -

    Yes, it does happen - you're right, but they were not traveling together, right...? Even brown bears will be close to each other during a salmon run, where there is tons of food.

    Bruce/GDog -

    Were any of those bears traveling together....? You'll often see a young bear overlap onto a dominate bear's territory.......until it gets eaten by the larger bear!!

    As I stated above, bears are not herd animals (like deer), and they need a lot of room - especially the large, dominate bears. You guys that see multiple bears in close proximity - I expect to see a trophy photo of you with one of them this season! Safe hunting boys!!

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    Quote Originally Posted by TheGDog View Post
    And I've seen two bears, 1st maybe 250 Lbs all-black and second possibly 350 Lbs cinnamon within 1.25 miles of each other within a timespan of maybe 2hrs, right here in Angeles Nat'l Forest.

    I'm pretty certain it had to do with presence of ripening choke-cherries and the nice breeze that blew thru that area on that hot Summer day.
    I think you're on to something, Gdog. Don't give up on your spot!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Where's Bruce? View Post
    Way too small...hold out for a rug, not a doormat!

    Or a mat to dry your feet after you exit the pool!
    Keep your nose to the wind and your eyes to the skyline.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Wild1 View Post
    You guys that see multiple bears in close proximity - I expect to see a trophy photo of you with one of them this season! Safe hunting boys!!
    FYI, I wasn't alone when it happened. I was with "Dre" who is also a member here. The tricky part is the choke cherries are all gone and eaten off those bushes before General Season opens. And I think that's why I didn't see them anymore during the 2 or 3 times I sat on that area (on a cliff overlooking it) for long periods of time when General Season came around. Or at least that's my thinking anyway. Like why else would they risk exposing themselves in that area which is more sparse in timber if there is no reward to be had in the form of those choke-cherries during General Season. At the end of August when we saw them, those choke-cherries were plentiful (and delicious! but they sure don't have a lot of flesh to them). And it was darn hot so I'm pretty sure that's why they were finding these little places where the path of the water would become canopied by young dogwood sapplings creating a cool shaded nook with damp cool ground. We (Me, Dre and his buddy) tried to go back there the next weekend after the initial encounter. We were upset to learn that the initial encounter was actually on the beginning day of Bear Bow season. Had we known we'd have taken our bows that day. We had gone there to scout for deer. He asked me if I knew of a place where there was water and I said yes, and took him there. Anyhoo on that second outing with bow... we jumped a blackie in one of those nooks. I only heard the startling whoosh sound of the blackie jumping out of the water. The guy walking in the middle position was the one that was confident it was not a deer. It was getting pretty dark by then. Me and the guy who said he saw it... we tried to go further down the water-way and work our way back thru the water way and left the 3rd hunter where we initially jumped him. Hoping to perhaps flush/push him towards the 3rd hunter. That was some nervy stuff for me to be doing being new with bow. Also after that 2 bears in one day occasion prior. We put up cams and confirmed they were going thru there... more towards last light.

    Right now.... unfortunately... I'm going to need more time....probably all of next year to work the pain back out of my wrist before I can try Archery again. After General season I'm probably going to have them go back into my wrist and remove the metal plate and screws, which is gonna sting the wallet, and then I'll have to wait for those left-behind screw-holes to fill back in again. We'll see. Depends on what kinda progress I can make with working out the pain and stiffness that certain movements invoke in it still. I know I do want to get those screws outta there. If something presses my flesh up against them in part of that area... pushing the flesh up against the protruding screwheads... it smarts pretty bad. This PM when I was pushing-up out of the pool, that side wasn't flexing enough and hurt a lil too much to attempt pushing with equal force from both hands... so I had to lean more to the other hand to compensate. This issue alarms me to a certain degree because usually I go out hunting alone. And right now... if I had to rely on that hand to pull me up out of something all by itself... pretty sure I'd be screwed.

    But anyway, didn't meant to bore you with all that... the main point in bringing it all up is that I shattered the head of my Radius bone right at the wrist while looking for Bear at another location, also in D11, the very last day of that season. So now... I kinda feel like I want to nab a bear as payback for my <bleeping> wrist getting broken. I'll definitely go back to that area again where the 2 encounters occured. It's like I feel like I just have to. That cliff position is a primo spot if I can happen to be there when one passes thru. And this time... if that BobCat tries to stalk up on me again like that, this time I have a tag with his name written on it.

    We'll see about the trophy photo.

    On the TrailCam I was seeing a smaller bear than the one from that day.
    EK000136 - Copy.jpg
    Appears to be multiple smaller younger bears going thru there.
    I'm not picky. It's a long all-uphill hike back outta there 7 miles.
    I'll gladly take a youngin' as my first bear.
    EK000141.jpgEK000144.jpg
    Last edited by TheGDog; 07-24-2016 at 04:46 AM.
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    That injury sounds horrible - hope it heals well and soon!! I'm sue if you stick with it, eventually you'll fill a bear tag - it may be a while, but it'll happen. I'm almost in my third week of scouting, with six cameras out (and five pounds lighter) and still don't have a bear on camera yet. For me, this drought is killing my scouting/hunting strategy. I'll be heading to the mountains tomorrow to pull some cards, hoping for the best - but like always, it ain't gonna be easy!

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    So HEY!, Wild1.. for giggles the other day... I go out into the garage and son of a gun! I was able to pull-back my BOW!! And my wrist didn't Kill!!! YAY!!!

    Took her out today with the little man. Long story shorter here's my best grouping at 40 yards . Felt good. Had the string loosened down quite a bit to begin with which probably tuned it back down to lik 50Lbs draw. Was doing so well with that I tightened it up like another 2 full rotations per each limb which I'm pretty sure gets me back up to 60 Lbs range. Noticed my Rt shoulder was doing better with the higher weight that before! This picture below was after the 2 tightening ups of my bows limbs.
    WP_20160807_014.jpg

    So Wild1... I felt this one a respectable grouping. But I hazard to guess you have different criterion. For you Wild1, when do you consider a person ready to bow hunt bears/deer?

    Whe they can get what size grouping at what distance in yards?
    "None of us was born knowing ANY of this! If someone else can do it, YOU can TOO!" - TheGDog
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    That wear is well over 50lbs. Do as you wish.

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    Quote Originally Posted by jerryt View Post
    That wear is well over 50lbs. Do as you wish.
    Was thinking the same thing, using the dirt road track behind the bear to help size it. Looks to be over 50lbs.
    There wasn't enough room in the boat.

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    I'm gonna respectfully disagree about the size of that bear. The photo is taken at an angle, the same angle that every seasoned bear hunter uses in trophy photos. Why....? Because it makes the bear look bigger than it really is. The road behind the bear is of no help whatsoever, simply because the road is perpendicular to the bear - making the bear appear larger, and the road looking smaller. I could be wrong, and maybe it is bigger than 50lbs., but certainly not by much, that much is certain. In any case, the hunter will make that call.

    GDog -
    I suppose experience is the best way to learn how to bow hunt, so you gotta get out there! I personally don't shoot groups, I only shoot two arrows at a time - once in the early morning, and once at dusk (to simulate hunting). I think we learn a lot by doing, so I say as long as a hunter is ethical, and poses no danger to anyone else, I say get out there and experience hunting..!!! All the best boyz!!!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Wild1 View Post
    I'm gonna respectfully disagree about the size of that bear. The photo is taken at an angle, the same angle that every seasoned bear hunter uses in trophy photos. Why....? Because it makes the bear look bigger than it really is. The road behind the bear is of no help whatsoever, simply because the road is perpendicular to the bear - making the bear appear larger, and the road looking smaller. I could be wrong, and maybe it is bigger than 50lbs., but certainly not by much, that much is certain. In any case, the hunter will make that call.

    GDog -
    I suppose experience is the best way to learn how to bow hunt, so you gotta get out there! I personally don't shoot groups, I only shoot two arrows at a time - once in the early morning, and once at dusk (to simulate hunting). I think we learn a lot by doing, so I say as long as a hunter is ethical, and poses no danger to anyone else, I say get out there and experience hunting..!!! All the best boyz!!!
    It's called depth perception and it's not a secret held only by seasoned bear hunters that take trophy photos. The angle of the shot has less to do with the fact that bear is in the foreground and thus makes it looks bigger and the road look smaller. Taking that into account the bear looks a bit bigger than my lab with a bigger head, bigger neck, bigger gut, bigger rump and larger legs. My Lab weighs 67lbs. I never said the bar was a monster just think it's over 50 for sure.
    There wasn't enough room in the boat.

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    GDog,
    If you can put 15 cold shot arrows inside a paper plate (about the size of the kill zone) at 30yds without a miss your good @ 30yds. Same goes for 40yds.
    Like Wild1 said it's a good idea to spread those 15 shots over 6 or so days, then your shooting cold like you will be when hunting. Doesn't mean you should't shoot more than a couple shots when practicing, just count the cold shots inside the plate to 15.
    There wasn't enough room in the boat.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Wild1 View Post
    I personally don't shoot groups, I only shoot two arrows at a time - once in the early morning, and once at dusk (to simulate hunting)
    I believe that it is more about muscle memory and repetition is the key. I'm certain that field goal kickers don't just kick a couple of balls a day, or a relief pitcher just throws 10 or so balls a day or that competition shooters only pull the trigger a few times a day. I believe in practice, practice, practice. Different positions and different angles, build muscle strength through repetition. Sit, kneel, stand even lay down and sit up and shoot, these are all real scenarios you may encounter in the field and need to be prepared for....JMO.
    Keep your nose to the wind and your eyes to the skyline.

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    It's all about these marvelous devices! I remember how shocked/thrilled/happy I was when I first got my bow in 2015 because even as a total n00b I was doing respectable even at 40-55yds with this thing. Got even better once I had a shop do the whole "paper-tune" business with me.

    That reminds me I gotta take the darn thing in again and probably get the damn string replaced. First time it was from the brush getting the string in my outings. Not sure what the deal is this time... but I noticed the black string they wrap around the bow string near one of the pullies (the bottom one) was coming unravelled Not so happy about that 'cause getting your bow worked on is never cheap.
    "None of us was born knowing ANY of this! If someone else can do it, YOU can TOO!" - TheGDog
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