Calif Prop 30 tax hike on Nov 2012 ballot

**Shoobee** · 08-01-2012, 07:02 AM

This has nothing to do with gun rights. But then neither do most if not all of the political postings here. I know I know, some will beg to differ, I know. That's called partisanship.

On the California ballot for November 2012 coming up, there is a Prop 30 in which Gov Brown has asked voters to approve a state sales tax hike to 7.5% from 7.25% making the overall sales tax in Calif anywhere from 7.25% to 9.75% depending on the additional county and city transit taxes thereon.

Also, the proposition carries a personal income tax hike on anyone earning over $250K with top rates increasing from 10.3% to 13.3% depending on the additional brackets of $250K, $300K, $500K, and $1 mil.

Right now at this moment the popularity of the tax bill is just barely over 50% somewhere. So it will be a close issue. The two taxes are forecasted to raise about $7 billion in state revenue per year.

The macroeconomics on this is that when the body politic is providing less tax revenue than before, due to in our case the great recession, more revenues need to be obtained from the remaining tax base who can pay.

The proposition raises taxes on both ends of the spectrum, the low end (with the sales tax hikes) and the high end (with the over-$250K state income tax hike). In that sense it attempts to reach everyone, as the sales tax hike would normally not materially impact the high end earners, and the income tax hike would not impact the low end earners at all.

There will be the usual squawking about cutting costs instead. But in these days of the great recession there actually is little choice. And Gov Brown has promised cuts alright, in education, if the proposition fails. So most people with K thru college kids see this as a tax hike that is needed. While the empty nest and no nest demographics see it as just another frivilous tax hike.

You've got to love partisanship to live in a democracy. I am sure the ancient Athenians never thought it would all come to this, when democracy was invented back in 510 B.C. in Athens Greece.

**Mr. Luckypants** · 08-01-2012, 07:27 AM

I am curious to know how other states have surplus? Maybe we can learn from them?

**Shoobee** · 08-01-2012, 07:30 AM

We can learn not to spend state money on college kids. That's why Gov Brown has earmarked cuts for education subsidies if the tax hikes do not pass.

**Mr. Luckypants** · 08-01-2012, 07:34 AM

I don't think 7.25% is enough. Maybe we should raise it 15%? Up the income tax on everyone making over $100k? Might as well do this right, right?

**J.O.** · 08-01-2012, 07:52 AM

Originally Posted by Mr. Luckypants

I am curious to know how other states have surplus? Maybe we can learn from them?

Well for starters, we have 1/3 of the welfare cases in the nation, we spend on average 3x more money per prisoner than other states, we have yet to have a balanced accurate budget, we have agreed to unreasonable union benefit packages/pensions that will tank the state alone. Remember to vote no on all tax hikes. The money never goes where they say its going to go. Just take a look at this bullet train propoganda. Its been a lie from the start on how much it would cost, maintenance cost, rider fees, where it will be built, etc. Its time we cut back expenses and do with less. We do it in our daily lives, maybe the government needs to as well.

**easymoney** · 08-01-2012, 07:57 AM

IMHO, no amount of money will ever be sufficient for our government.
All of our legislators have a serious spending problem and until a major change is made in that process, ie: proper budgeting and accountability, we can only expect as taxpayers is to see more and more new taxes or fees.

**Shoobee** · 08-01-2012, 08:09 AM

Originally Posted by Mr. Luckypants

I don't think 7.25% is enough. Maybe we should raise it 15%? Up the income tax on everyone making over $100k? Might as well do this right, right?

You're sort of rambling now, a shotgun approach to making a piece of pizza stick on the wall.

**Shoobee** · 08-01-2012, 08:14 AM

Originally Posted by J.O.

Well for starters, we have 1/3 of the welfare cases in the nation, we spend on average 3x more money per prisoner than other states, we have yet to have a balanced accurate budget, we have agreed to unreasonable union benefit packages/pensions that will tank the state alone. Remember to vote no on all tax hikes. The money never goes where they say its going to go. Just take a look at this bullet train propoganda. Its been a lie from the start on how much it would cost, maintenance cost, rider fees, where it will be built, etc. Its time we cut back expenses and do with less. We do it in our daily lives, maybe the government needs to as well.

Secretly I think Gov. Brown really does want to do away with the K thru college state funding. But he also realizes he needs the concurrence of the voters to do it. He can't just rip away state benefits from college kids overnight. So implicitly I think Gov. Brown is actually trying to take your advice, J.O., and do some serious cutting.

The polling on this issue is close, 50% for and against, too close to call.

I too am inclined to vote against it, but that's because I did not need state funding when I went to college. NROTC paid for my schooling, and then I paid Uncle Sam back with 6 years of military duty. When I see college kids protesting on tv, I am not sympathetic.

**Shoobee** · 08-01-2012, 08:16 AM

Originally Posted by easymoney

IMHO, no amount of money will ever be sufficient for our government.
All of our legislators have a serious spending problem and until a major change is made in that process, ie: proper budgeting and accountability, we can only expect as taxpayers is to see more and more new taxes or fees.

That is a reasonable overall assessment everywhere, in the federal as well as the state capitols.

**Mr. Luckypants** · 08-01-2012, 08:26 AM

Originally Posted by J.O.

Remember to vote no on all tax hikes. The money never goes where they say its going to go.

Oh I know. Some people like to give their hard earned money away but I don't. My post about upping the taxes to 15% was sarcasm to noobee.

**easymoney** · 08-01-2012, 09:56 AM

Originally Posted by easymoney

IMHO, no amount of money will ever be sufficient for our government.
All of our legislators have a serious spending problem and until a major change is made in that process, ie: proper budgeting and accountability, we can only expect as taxpayers is to see more and more new taxes or fees.

That is a reasonable overall assessment everywhere, in the federal as well as the state capitols.

And as is being seen today in every branch of government, from Federal, State, down to local branches of individual counties, they are all sagging under the oppressive burden brought on by uncontrolled overall spending, huge underfunded union pensions, outrageous welfare entitlement spending and complete lack of accountability to the public which all branches serve...
Mark my words, taxes are going to go up accross the board and many of our historic levels of taxation like Prop 13 will be either removed or amended to allow more cash for the wasting...
Until there is control of the budgets (fed down through the counties)and there is accountability by all of our elected legislators, we are going to see this happen. Does not matter what political flavor is in control at the moment, they all have a spending problem and lack of control...

**Marty** · 08-01-2012, 01:27 PM

It's really bad when the legislative bodies and the governor ( pick one, any one) cannot pass a realistic budget that stays within the current tax income and does not draw from future taxes. For that reason alone, they should all be fired and released without a pension.

Gov. Brown will get his income tax hike because the liberal bias on college campuses will send the late-teen voters to the polls to ensure that college subsidies are borne by the taxpayers.

Oh, and I think it is cowardly how politicians threaten "essential services" when demanding additional taxation.

**MULEY51** · 08-01-2012, 03:39 PM

Originally Posted by J.O.

Well for starters, we have 1/3 of the welfare cases in the nation, we spend on average 3x more money per prisoner than other states, we have yet to have a balanced accurate budget, we have agreed to unreasonable union benefit packages/pensions that will tank the state alone. Remember to vote no on all tax hikes. The money never goes where they say its going to go. Just take a look at this bullet train propoganda. Its been a lie from the start on how much it would cost, maintenance cost, rider fees, where it will be built, etc. Its time we cut back expenses and do with less. We do it in our daily lives, maybe the government needs to as well.

You hit it on the nose.

**slanttop357** · 08-01-2012, 04:28 PM

Pensions need to have a big hole punched right through it, yes these people earned it but come on, my friends brother and his wife each get 10K for the rest of there life, must be nice just think of what you could do with $10,000.00 a month BULL$HIT. oops

**dustin ray** · 08-01-2012, 04:52 PM

Theres no way there 50% support for this bull $hit
moon beam will fail at at raising taxes
And this is a tax on all not just the so called rich
more new taxes no no no no no no no no no no no no hell no
If the real problems where fixed there would be no problems

**Shoobee** · 08-01-2012, 08:12 PM

Originally Posted by Marty

It's really bad when the legislative bodies and the governor ( pick one, any one) cannot pass a realistic budget that stays within the current tax income and does not draw from future taxes. For that reason alone, they should all be fired and released without a pension.

Gov. Brown will get his income tax hike because the liberal bias on college campuses will send the late-teen voters to the polls to ensure that college subsidies are borne by the taxpayers.

Oh, and I think it is cowardly how politicians threaten "essential services" when demanding additional taxation.

Well democracy is democracy. One person one vote.

If the kids all get together and vote together, and their parents, then they might outnumber the rest of us, sure.

Democracy has its flaws. Nobody said it was perfect.

**Val** · 08-02-2012, 06:45 AM

Yes, the dummycrat approach is to raise taxes and drive more companies and taxpaying people out of Commiefornia. That's what got us to where we are today.

**easymoney** · 08-02-2012, 12:16 PM

On the California ballot for November 2012 coming up, there is a Prop 30 in which Gov Brown has asked voters to approve a state sales tax hike to 7.5% from 7.25% making the overall sales tax in Calif anywhere from 7.25% to 9.75% depending on the additional county and city transit taxes thereon.

Moonbeam is desperate...

CA Gov. Brown Allegedly Took $3 Million from 9/11 Fund

As California teeters near default in many areas, news is breaking that Gov. Jerry Brown may have taken up to $3 million from a fund created "in honor of the victims of the 2001 terror attacks" to make up for shortfalls.

http://www.breitbart.com/Big-Governm...itbart+Feed%29