Adventure pass

[EVAN III]

I was just wondering what you guys and gals think about the Nat'l forest adventure pass.

[Fubar]

Its another tax. ### ### ### ### ### ### ### ### ### ### Fubar

[tinner]

my wife's oldest brother has ###had one since they came out. he claims that he has seen a great improvement in the day use areas(new paint more trash cans etc) as far as benifiting the hunter i don't know, was it supposed to. ###

[Pasco]

It's a beautiful thing, right up there with sales tax, income tax, and hemorrhoids.

(Edited by SoCalxJR at 4:19 pm on Nov. 9, 2001)

[Bishop]

It su*ks. ###National Forrest land is our land. ###What really su*ks is the fact that the only people the Forrest Service does this to is the people in So. Cal. San Bernardino, Los Padres, Cleveland, and Angeles forrests are the only ones requiring this additional taxation. ###Isn't the National Forrest system national? It costs $30.00 for an annual pass. ###The first year you got a additional pass for your second vehicle for free. ###Then they decided that you should pay an additional $5.00 each for up to 4 additional passes, since your obviously rich if you have more than one car.
And now this year you can only have 1 additional pass for $5.00. ###So if your filthy rich and have a 3rd vehicle in the family you have to buy another $30.00 pass. ###
It's that same belief around the country that everyone in So. Cal is rich. ###Yes we make more money than a lot of areas, but our houses cost more than just about anywhere in the country. ###For the price of a house in Orange County you could buy half of Wyoming. (no offense Wyoming, you got a great state)
Anyway, I could go on and on about how the Adventure ###Pass burns me up. ###But, I won't put you through it. ###

[Speckmisser]

Personally, I think it's a crock. ###I've (so far) refused to buy one, but as it turns out, I don't spend as much time in Los Padres as I'd planned to anyway. ###

I can see the rationale behind it, in theory. ###There's not enough tax money being directed to the "plain-jane" National Forest areas. ###It's all going to the places with attractions, like Yosemite and Yellowstone. ###So they come up with this foolishness to make money for the other areas...except, of course, any money they make is going to go right back to Yosemite and Yellowstone. ###

If they insist that such a pass is necessary, then I think hunters and fishermen should be exempted, since our fees are supposedly going to fund those areas already. ###How about making some of the non-hunters pay a share before they start charging us twice for the same thing? ###

Like some others, I could go on and on about this... but I won't.

[feelinducky]

It's C-R-A-P.

[grtwythunter]

### Biggest bunch of ......there is in my opinion. Our taxes pay for the NF. Then everything we buy to hunt or fish has an extra tax on it. Part of which goes to the NF. Then we get to pay to use the NF. BS!!!
### I have never seen an "improvent" in any part of the Angeles NF that I use. Unless of course you count hiring more rangers to write more tickets for not displaying you pass.
### I've been driving past the same truckload of trash that was dumped since before D11 archery opened(Sept 3rd). It is in the middle of a FS road. Overflowing trash can still abound, and its not that they keep filling up. They never get emptied! ### ### ### ### ###
### I agree that something has to be done about our public land. I would almost not mind paying (a lesser fee or exemption for sportsmen would be nice since we're already footing a large part of the bill) if I actually saw some improvements.
### I would love to boycott and never set foot in anNF again till the "experimental program" is thrown away. But around here thats about all we have to fish or hunt deer on.
###Thanks for the forum to vent. I feel cleansed now. Now....where's my pass so I can enjoy my day out tomorrow without a hassle? ### ### Scott

[Stryder]

It's a total joke! WE are already taxed beyond belief, some of which is supposed to go to OUR Nat'l Forests but if you live in So Cal WE have to pay an extra $30 to use OUR land that WE'VE already paid for. Supposedly it's used to clean up the forest but I see the same trash in the same places that's been there for a long time. How about grafitti on the rocks? Still there. ###While I'm forced to buy one to hunt and fish on the Nat'l Forest as far as I'm concerned the Nat'l Forest service can K.M.A.!!!!!!!!

### ### ### ### ### ### ### ### ### ### Stryder

[Hook]

What's an Adventure Pass???? just kidding..:mad-fumin-red:

I refuse to buy one and havent bought one since they came up with the "TAX". I already pay taxes just for this kind of stuff, if they mis-manage the tax money, it is their problem. It does'nt mean they can create a new "tax" to generate more money.

[EVAN III]

###OK. just as I thought you guys feel the same as I do. I have not seen any improvements in the areas I hunt and fish. Just thought I'd ask because last time I was out hunting with my Dad, we stopped to get an adventure at the ranger station and there were several guys refinishing the outside of the station. Just then I finally saw our money being put to use. I don't know about you guys, but I think we should see alot more improvement ###then a pretty ranger station. I would'nt mind paying for it if the money were spent to improve the land.

[Sidekick]

The adventure tax generates a visceral contempt that I find hard to put into words !

[Mojave]

I have a brochure from the first year this "voluntary" program was started. The idea was to evaluate users, to see if they would be willing to pay the $30 fee for a year's use, or $5 for a day's use. The decision to continue the program was based on the number of "willing" participants. Of course, the threat of a $300 fine for not participating while parking in the forest didn't show up in the report of the experimental program's success. I wrote to the office administering the program, suggesting that they sell a red pass to those people participating under protest, and a green pass to the willing volunteers, but my suggestion was passed up. Two things that just FROST me about the program are: 1. The introductory brocure assured the public that the program was set up to improve the forest campgrounds and facilities. With a forest pass, you would recieve a camping discount. My favorite developed campground (Mountain Oaks, up above Jackson Lake), was improved with flush toilets, and a full-time "camp manager". It was immediately thereafter turned over to a private company for management. The Forest Pass was no longer necessary to camp there, and gave you no discount from the new higher prices. This is double taxation, and theft of public lands and money. 2. Check out the more populated areas of the National Forests (example: Big Rock Creek). Watch for the selective enforcement of the Forest Pass rules. People that look like they can pay are ticketed. Those that don't are "warned". Yes. I do have a Forest Pass sticker on my old Jeep. No. I am not a big fan of this program.

[rusman66]

I think this forrest pass is a great idea. And I have seen major improvements in the forrests I use.
Juuuuuust Kidding!!!!!
Hey I guess that is why so many guys road hunt!!
They cant afford to stop and park!!! ###HAAAAA

"Make no mistake its not revenge he's after,
It's a reckoning"

(Edited by rusman66 at 5:01 pm on Nov. 11, 2001)

[doghouse95]

I have this picture in my head that I can't get rid of. ###I spend a lot of time a-horseback in
our national forests, wilderness areas, and National parks. ###Where are they going to put
the sticker on my horses?????
Many years ago, I got almost caught in Lassen National Park on a horse. ###The cute little
park ranger that was after me, was in very good physical shape. ###I was on a pretty green
colt, but he liked to go, so when she tried to flag me down and approach me, we just
turned and went ###up the side ###of a mountain, a big mountain. ###This little cutie, was running
up the mountain after me. ###About every hundred yards I would have to stop and let my horse blow ###for a minute, and I would sit and watch cutie running up the mountain towards us.
When she got close I would just turn and take off again. ###This happened four or five
times before I reached the top of the mountain. ###As I sat on the top of that mountain
waiting for her to reach the top, I gave her a big wave, blew her a kiss, and went down the
other side.
I don't live in southern Ca. and I never will. ###I have no use for that many people all in one
place, with open spaces close to nonexistent, and teeming with people when you can find
them.
As far as the Government of the Peoples Republic Of Kalifornia, the only thing they are
worried about is southern Ca. ###They don't give a shit about the north state, we don't have
the voting populace to effect their reelection.
I obey game laws, I practice no trace camping, but they will not stop me from using public
land, or tax me when I chose to use it.
Sure would be nice to have a state of our own up this way..

[Marty]

Yeah Doghouse. ###Those Northern Rangers are in better shape than the ones in Southern California. ###Down here they sit at your vehicle, drink some coffee, scarf a donut, and wait until you come back out. ###
Seriously, I've seen it. ###They even tried to issue me a ticket for parking on a public road right-of-way that was 100 yds from the forest boundary. ###I had a word with their supervisor.

[songdog]

The only time that I ever got in trouble for shooting/tresspassing on private land was when I was turkey hunting up near Santa Maria. ###There was one of those "Forest Adventure Pass Required Behind this Sign" signs up that gave the locations of local merchants that sold them. ###I checked my map and it seemed like I was in the Nat'l Forest.

I was only about a quarter mile in when I shot a nice turkey and then had an angry ###land owner come up and give me what for about shooting on his land. ###Confused as I was I apologozed profusely and asked about the sign back on the road. ###He said that he'd told the Forest Service about this (I wasn't the first evidently) and they weren't going to take the time to move the sign the other half mile further down the dirt road where the Nat'l Forest actually started.

I apologized and we actually had a civil talk about the Forest Service and how they screwed up. ###I go to great lengths to make sure I'm not where I shouldn't be... to get strung out by the Forest Service on something like this chaps my britches.

[tinner]

mojave are you talking about the jackson lake in wrightwood just down the road from mtn.high. if so it has always been refered to as more of a mud hole than a lake by my family. my great grandfater and grandfather built a house up there that is still in the family. by the way would a resident have to have a pass.

[Mojave]

Yeah, Tinner, that's the place. If you go up the road, towards Mtn High, then hook a sharp left at the highway, and go up the hill, instead of going on towards Wrightwood, you will find a campground with a great view of the desert on one side, and a view of Catalina on the other! Jackson is just a little pond formed by an earthquake, but I have kids, and they can always catch fish there. Not too far to hike to some decent hunting, but I live down in the desert, and mostly go up there to escape the heat of summer. I think even residents need a pass, unless they are parked on private property.