CA DFG Moto survey

[Mike Riley]

DFG has the survey up, but due to a browser compatability issue the survey form won't be operational for a day or two. ###If you read the disclosure you'll notice DFG isn't looking at decoys that create motion on water, only mechanical-motion decoys with spinning or rotating wings (the optical illusion of "flocking" ). ###So give it a day or two than visit the CA DFG website at:
http://www.dfg.ca.gov/shoot/moto_quest.html

(Edited by Mike Riley at 10:11 am on May 23, 2001)

[Duck Fan]

Any good survey should include a space for comments in addition to check boxes.

Also - there ARE spinning wing decoys that sit on the water....so I think their statement about movement on the water not being included could cause confusion. ###I have seen the spinning wing decoys on the water decoys (in essence, a moto type spin on a water decoy). ###I think they need to be clear they are talking about ALL "spinning" wing decoys regardless of where they are placed (example: Halt M Duck decoy's Duk N 8R).

[jerry d]

Thanks Mike,

This is what we all have been waiting for with great anticipation.

Gonna be real interesting to see the comments about the survey and length of the thread.

I'm betting on at least 4 pages.

[Scank]

I've read the report. I predict all you anti-moto people are going to be really disappointed. Now lets see if somebody puts a measure on the ballot banning ALL decoys.

[E A Hunt]

Skank

Where did you read "The Report "?

I'd like to read it also. I wasn't even aware there was a "Report ".

Since you have read it why don't you enlighten us with the findings in " The Report ".

Oh boy.....can't wait..........at last "the Report " spit it out tuffy.

### ### ###

[E A Hunt]

That survey is in need of a comment box. ###I could have checked three box's in question 4.

Any theroy on DFG's point for doing this ?

Hope it's not a popularity contest cause Moto will win.

They need a few more questions to boot.

Did your Moto suck a load of young Mallards into your spread early in the season ?
### ### ### ### ### ### ### ### ### ### ### ### ### ### ### ### ### ### ### ### ### ### ### ### YES

Did you pass on other ducks you would have been happy to shoot the year before because you knew your E-Toy would sooner or later suck some mallards in ?
### ### ### ### ### ### ### ### ### ### ### ### ### ### ### ### ### ### ### ### ### ### ### ### ###YES

Does the sight of all those spinning wing's kinda ruin the veiw out on the marsh ?
### ### ### ### ### ### ### ### ### ### ### ### ### ### ### ### ### ### ### ### ### ### ### ### ### YES

Did you notice the heads of below Avg. hunters and daffy duck sounding callers swell up to twice their normal size after a most excelent day of "hunting " ?
### ### ### ### ### ### ### ### ### ### ### ### ### ### ### ### ### ### ### ### ### ### ### ### ### ###YES

### ### ### ### ### ### ### ### ### ### ### ### ### ### ### Will you miss it if it goes away ?
### ### ### ### ### ### ### ### ### ### ### ### ### ### ### ### ### ###ya, like a hole in the head

[Scank]

Read the report at the DFG office in Yountville. Went to buy my Deer Tag applications. This was tuesday. Basically, the report stated there was no significant impact when using the motion decoy. Ask Riley.. I don't have a copy..

[Scank]

Hey Tuff-guy! The report I saw was in the DFG newsletter. It was published a few months ago. It stated a possible slight rise in the harvest, but no significant impact. How many studies do we need? Only in California!!! Maybe we can have a survey on the pros and cons of banning hunting.

[Swampy]

Hey EA Hunt, all good points. Especially the one about ruining the view. I would love to fly over some of the areas on opening morning just to see all the flapping going on. I really enjoy ###sitting in the marsh, watching the sunrise, and sipping some hot coffee while hearing the sound of electrical motors and off balance wings wobbling. Nothing better. Not! Like you said, if it goes away I won't miss it.

[Duck Fan]

To Mike Riley - do you know who's idea it was to set up this web survey? ###And do you know how long it will be up? ###There are a lot of hunters who will no doubt never see it as they don't necessarily frequent the DFG site or these forum pages. ###Also, I assume that any hunter - even out of state hunters would be able to submit their "opinions"...so I am not to sure they will get true CA hunter data.

[Duck Fan]

Mike - sorry - I do see that they do have a place for the hunters address....so I guess they could only use data submitted from CA hunters. ###Not sure if they will, but I guess they could.

[Mike Riley]

My understanding is DFG will check the data (name, ###address, ect) against the DFG license data base and catch false and/or multiple enteries. ###Hopefully DFG will get a responsible response on the website, plus they have held 4 meetings around the state and collected the same survey there. ### Nothings perfect, but this well give them some idea of where hunters are on the issue.

[Duck Fan]

Thanks Mike. ###Since I am not able to attend the meetings, I did send a letter to all the DFG commissioners, and also a copy to Greg Yarris. ###Greg sent me back a real nice card thanking me for the letter.

[Scank]

I love these unscientific surveys. In fact, I voted probably 50 times on the CWA survey. If the DFG does check the data base, I doubt it, then just use the name of somebody who has a hunting license. Yea, nothing is perfect.

[Jay]

You're a piece of work Scank. ### ###

50 times eh? Did you try "Joe Smith" fifty different times and just modify the email address each time?

But you're right about these polls. Only the real passionate people will take the time to respond so you're going to end up with polarized results, but no science.

My offer still stands.

[E A Hunt]

Dang Scank

Who peeeed in your Cherrios ? Why the bitterness ALL the time ?

Your "Report " was just a news article uugh. Not really a report I sapose. It was probably based on a few quick feild reports type surveys or some such.

Where exactly does the Scankester stand on the Moto issue ?

Wouldn't you agree that if the use of Moto help in the over harvest of Calif. Mallards especialy young birds early in the season that something should be done to correct it.

Don't you think it make's hunting a bit to lazy and easy for newbies ?
###
I know I paid my dues for a long long time before i figured it out. (I still don't know Jack) ### ###

As far as a debate on the pros and cons well seeing my kids in the field and teaching them what little I know is the biggest pro for me.
Running into the Scanks of the world while my kids are with me is the biggest CON.

Lighten up guy. Try adding something positve for once.

[Scank]

How do you know that young mallards were shot instead of old mallards in the beginning of the season? More birds were killed in the beginning simply because there was less rot water. Then, as the season progressed with no storms to speak of and every field flooded we ended up with a terrible season.
I don't use a moto. I've seen them when I drive down Princton Road on refuge shoot days. It looks like every hunter in the Sact Refuge had one. When there were so many motos why was the bag down 30%? Mallards aren't the only bird in the flyway. If there is a real problem with the mallard population reduce the limit on them and start shooting other birds. Or, ban all motion decoys such as kites and even strings on decoys moving them up-and down.
By the way, did somebody in the CWA hierarchy get the word to tone it down. I can't wait for his loyal followers to jump in on this one.

[Greenhead]

I think it's great that the DFG is seeking input on the issue. I can't remember them doing such public outreach, and I hope it continues on this and many other issues.

And Scank, as for your comment about "how do we know the age of the birds shot" and you're silly reply, well the USFW and DFG do know the age from the wings they collect from folks participating in their yearly studies. It's called science and statistics, but I imagine both are a little over your head.

I've participated twice in the the studies, and every year they send a report of the species and age of the ducks I shot. The vast, vast majority were 1st year birds, and that's the way it's always been. However, with the moto in place more and more older birds (i.e. the ones who have survival instincts, good nesting habits, and the ability to avoid/escape predators) are falling from the sky at an alarming rate.

It's a serious issue, Scank. If you care so much about duck hunting, educate yourself.

[Scank]

Greenhead, I've participated in the wing survey also. The younger birds are always the one's with the higher hunter mortality rate. It doesn't matter what specie, mallard or whatever.
Where is the information you talk about when you state older birds are being killed at an alarming rate because of the moto? Again, I always thought the 1st year birds were the first to be hammered. Alarming rate? DFG stats from the refuges reported a 30% reduction in last years harvest.
If you are correct Greenhead lets try to ban all decoys like some countries have done. Hey, if you are that worried about this issue don't use a moto or shoot mallards. I don't and I'm no rocket scientist like yourself.

[Mike Riley]

The biggest indicator of bird age and location shot is band return data. ###Sorry Scank - Hman - whatever nobody has told me to do anything, I am just watching to see how this thread develops. ###As usual you don't no squat and prove every post. Chio.

[Jay]

I'm retracting this one. That's the second time somebody's got bent out of shape when I start playing with words.

Remember the "Glaze Orange" exchange from the old board? It was funny and so is "You no squat", but the fun isn't worth the misunderstanding.

Sorry Scank, I apologize for the implication although I was sincerely just having fun with Riley's "no squat". Sometimes fun gets a little out of hand. I've been known to get on a roll and not know (not no) when to stop.

(Edited by Jay at 6:51 pm on May 26, 2001)


(Edited by Jay at 6:52 pm on May 26, 2001)

[Scank]

Riley, is it "no" or "know" squat. I have disagreed with alot of the posts but have never used inflamatory language or personal remarks. You,on the other hand seem to enjoy getting personal(my father) and use seedy language.
As an official in the CWA I would hope you become more professional. Remember,kids visit this website.
By the way, I'm still looking for a 100 yd. sporting clay tower so I can pracice those 95 yd shots. Chio

[Speckmisser]

Mike and Scank.

It's "Ciao". ###Not Chio. ###

Sorry. ###Had to do that. ###We now return you to our regularly scheduled personal feud.

[Greenhead]

Scank, the info was in a double-top-secret DFG publication called Tracks. They are very selective with the distribution, and only send it to me and a few million other hunters. However, if you're really crafty you could lift one from the counter at any DFG office and lots of sporting goods stores.

Tracks reported that despite the local hatch being down something like 16%, the mallard harvest rate per hunter for the first 17 days of the season was up for the past three years or so.

Plus, the numbers of hunters in the marsh has gone up something like 20-25%, which means that even more mallards are being killed. Are you following this? More hunters killing more mallards means less mallards.

As for the older birds and more hens being killed, I can't remember where I read it, but I'll try and find it so I can get your valuable thoughts and opinions. In the meantime, go do a little reading and research. You'd be surprised what's there if you take the time.

[Scank]

Greenhead, was the mallard harvest up for the entire season or only for the first 17 days. I guess the harvest was reduced as the season went on because they were all killed via the "moto." Rot water had nothing to do with the harvest reduction after 17 days when just about ALL the fields were flooded. Lets ban decoys and forget about the water problem.
Jay, Jay, or Darth,whatever your name is. I'm surprized you have reacted and reduced yourself to name calling like your buddy. Boy, you guys are thin skinned. Jay, at least you seem to be an ethical hard working hunter that doesn't shoot 95 yds. I'm still surprized at your low-blow. Anyway, Carpo jay and I'll take you up on the offer but not on the refuge--to much strife.

[grizz]

I hate to enterrupt you guy little squable but I can't seem to get my survey to go through. ###It keeps telling me I haven't entered a nickname but I don't see a place for a nick name. ###Anyone eles have this problem? ###Or know what I doing wrong? ###Thanks

[Jay]

Scank, Scank, Scank you've made a leap in logic there. I'm not calling you names although I can see how you took it that way. Sorry. 80% of communication is non-verbal. This medium of communication lacks, body language, voice inflection and eye contact so meaning is often construed.

I started off my post with a little tongue-in-cheek by playing off your "loyal follower" comment.

It's sarcasm Scank. I'm not a loyal follower of your nemisis. We've had that discussion before.

Therefore the second line of my post was invalid. I do not think whatever your nemisis says is true. You're gonna have to trust me on this one since I would be the only person who knows.

The third section of my post is just some good ol' potty humor. Your nemisis made a slip in his use of English words so I was making a little play on words. My statement would apply to anyone who did "no squat".

English is a hilarious language with all it's double meanings and words that are pronounced the same but mean different things. "You no squat" was an opportunity I could not pass (oops sorry, more double-meaning potty talk there!) up.

I worked with a guy from Russia who was taking a class for Russians learning to speak English. It seems Russians often pronounce the short "i" sound the same as the long "e" sound. He came to me and asked me what the difference was between "sheet" and "s**t" because they were both pronounced the same to him. After several minutes of discussion he finaly understood when I told him that: "Taking a s**t is not a crime, however if you take a sheet without paying for it you can be arrested for shoplifting". .......True story, I swear.

What a riot!

Anyway back to the subject, Scank I don't think you're a "s***head".


### ###

[Duck Fan]

Griz - we all are getting the same error. ###I think Mike Riley said they were still working on some browser problems. ###Is that right Mike?

[Mike Riley]

Yes, DFG may still be having browser problems. ###Try it next week. ###Scank you need to learn to read. ###There is a big difference between the make up of "local" early season mallards and late season birds. ###That's why in normal seasons we harvest more mallards late - hence more northern migrating birds. ###Early with moto we have killed more local birds and could cause problems with local breeding stock.
BTW - your a funny guy "never used inflamatory language or personal remarks" and brain dead if you think that, too.

Speckmisser, your right spelling error, but no was intentional.

[Jay]

Can't wait to squat in some tules waiting for them duckies to drop their little legs down.

[E A Hunt]

HA HA real funny stuff Jay Bird....

It's always such a laugher until somebody gets their eye's poked out HA HA HA.

Now Scank is really blind. HA HA HA hope you feel real bad Mr. Darth. Are you happy now ?

[Swampy]

That's why I always wear glaze orange, it keeps people from poking my eye out. ###Hey Darth, go squat in your own tules, this ponds mine!