Does this Annoy Anyone Else?

[Gunslingergirl]

So I was doing a search for gifts for women who hunt, and this page came up

Arkansas Duck Hunter Hunting Gifts for Women (http://www.arkansasduckhunter.com/hunting_gifts_for_women.asp)

Now, I'm sorry, but I don't think there are a lot of women hunters who are going to be going out hunting in their camo bikini.

Apparently if you're a women who hunts, all you need is a camo bikini, nightwear or underwear, or a camo checkbook cover.

I think someone needs to tell these guys that women actually hunt.

Granted this is kind of funny, but it also bugs me a little.

Am I the only one?

GSG

[pbrdog]

I'd go hunting with a woman that is wearing a cami bikini.

[Speckmisser]

I dunno, Kristine. I'm not especially offended by the camo boxers, neckties, or apron either, even though I probably won't be wearing any of those next time I go out in the field. I won't be carrying a camo wallet, cell-phone, or key fob either.

It's just novelty items, nothing more.

Then again, my brother bought some camo panties and a teddy for his wife, and she reportedly wears them regularly. There's no telling about some folks.

D'oh! I'll leave my response, but I guess your question was probably directed to the women on the board, not us guys.

Sorry about that.

[PaHaSaPa]

OK I looked. I did not find one piece of acutal women's hunting gear anywhere on that site.
Kinda of joke actually
But, it's all about marketing and the demographics you market to. Hence, the bikini clad girls
are the first images seen. Somebody went to school just so they could tell you what you like and
want, I why it is so.
I like the female form like most guys, but not as a marketing ploy and it surely would not influence
my buying. Too old for that!

Gunslingergirl

Did you find a site that did a better job of catering/marketing to the women hunter??

[thehunterswife]

I'm not a hunter but my husband is. Some here know that already. http://www.jesseshunting.com/forums/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/smiley-wave-hello-yellow.gif

If I were a hunter I wouldn't wear that under my hunting clothes or to bed.

If I was 18 again, I might wear it for my hubby.

Advertising as hunting gifts for women just doesn't seem right. When I first took a look at it, I thought of it as hunting gifts for women from their hunting husbands or boyfriends.

This is a nice forum and I hope to check it often.

The Hunter's Wife

www.thehunterswife.net (http://www.thehunterswife.net)

[Gunslingergirl]

QUOTE (Speckmisser @ Dec 13 2007, 08:36 PM)
I dunno, Kristine. I'm not especially offended by the camo boxers, neckties, or apron either, even though I probably won't be wearing any of those next time I go out in the field. I won't be carrying a camo wallet, cell-phone, or key fob either.

It's just novelty items, nothing more.

Then again, my brother bought some camo panties and a teddy for his wife, and she reportedly wears them regularly. There's no telling about some folks.

D'oh! I'll leave my response, but I guess your question was probably directed to the women on the board, not us guys.

Sorry about that.

Speck,

I'm not especially offended by the camo bikini etc. either. I just wish they offered actual equipment and clothes for women who were hunters in addition to this stuff. I guess, to me, this just implies that women don't hunt, they just look cute in camo. If the site had actual hunting gear for women, I might feel a bit differently.

Also, I don't mind if the men come and comment. The more the merrier. Plus, it is interesting to get the guy's perspective.

[Gunslingergirl]

QUOTE (PaHaSaPa @ Dec 13 2007, 09:46 PM)
Gunslingergirl

Did you find a site that did a better job of catering/marketing to the women hunter??

I did not. Although I haven't looked all that hard yet either. I'll do some searching and see if I can find one. I know there are a couple of clothing manufacturers who make hunting clothes specifically for women. I'll see if I can find them.

[Gunslingergirl]

QUOTE (thehunterswife @ Dec 14 2007, 12:39 AM)
Advertising as hunting gifts for women just doesn't seem right. When I first took a look at it, I thought of it as hunting gifts for women from their hunting husbands or boyfriends.

This is a nice forum and I hope to check it often.

The Hunter's Wife

www.thehunterswife.net (http://www.thehunterswife.net)

That's how I took it too. I guess what bugged me is the title "Hunting Gifts for Women" which led me to believe I might find equipment or clothes for women who hunt. I don't have anything against camo undies, I just don't think they really qualify as hunting gifts.

By the way, glad to see you here. I hope you keep coming back.

[NorCal Cazadora]

QUOTE (Gunslingergirl @ Dec 13 2007, 02:04 PM)
Granted this is kind of funny, but it also bugs me a little.

Am I the only one?

GSG

Ya know, I came across that in my regular net searches too and didn't click on it for some reason. Now that I did, I'm just irritated. Love the men's gift suggestions - think I'll get my guy that "I hunt for big racks" T-shirt (NOT!). Please, Lord, please tell me that stuff is for 17-year-olds?

Actually Dana turned me on to something that I added to my Christmas wish list: a women's hunting union suit that, with creative zippering, allows a gal to take care of business out in the field without baring all. She brought it up when I mentioned that I've only cut one hunt off early, and that was during the cold snap in California last January when it was in the 20s w/25 mph winds. I was fine with sitting in the blind, but I'd had a lot of coffee and there was NO WAY I was going to bare my butt in that icy wind.

If you're interested, it's item no. XH-912627 at Cabelas. I'll let you know on Christmas whether Santa took care of me!

[attachment=47737:Polartec.jpg]

[duckdog]

GSG,

I have always felt like you do about hunting sites for women. It's more focused on the male species needs. Not ours. Kinda like going to a DU or CWA dinner and the "Sex sells" girls are out selling tickets....PLEASE! I once and ONLY once went to a Phil Robertson speech about Duckhunting. As I sat and became angered about his remarks of women and duckhunting. I wanted to stand up and let him have an ear full, but Hubby gave me the look......I had better not. One women against at least 70 men, I was in a no win situation. The next year he showed up. I got my point across before his speech. I left before his speech...He makes me SICK!

As more of us women become involved with hunting things will change. I have been hunting now for 20 years and I have seen the change coming slowly. It's nice to see the fathers getting their girls into hunting. And husband and wifes in the field together. With TV and internet. Girls/Women are seeing others that love to hunt. So now more are taking an interest in it. I can remember in the earlier years being called a Dike..... http://www.jesseshunting.com/forums/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/afraid_face.gif Only because I loved to hunt.

Holly,

That's the Union suit...I love mine. They use to make a pair of pants with the zipper. I have a pair, and can't find them anywhere to buy now.

[el_vaquero]

I'm only annoyed because my wife won't wear it! Just kidding.....but if you're looking for hunting clothing I think the better women's selections can be found at Cabela's or Bass Pro.

[Jean]

It's just the standard stupid guy stuff. I thought pretty much everything I saw on the site was lame. When I see something like that, I figure they're not interested in selling to me so I just close the tab. Makes me think of a bunch of clueless guys at a bar deciding what women like. Somewhat entertaining for the first 8 or 10 seconds.

Don't get me wrong. There's a place for camo underwear and silly things like that. It's just that the guys who put the ad out are not really thinking with their brains.
Just my humble personal opinion.

Jean

[duckdog]

QUOTE (el_vaquero @ Dec 14 2007, 09:24 AM)
if you're looking for hunting clothing I think the better women's selections can be found at Cabela's or Bass Pro.

I agree, both have a better selection. Still though, a lot of the women's clothes are not made for warm with camo pattern. Take waders, only 3mm for women. I don't wear anything less the 5mm with 1600 thins. in the boots. (I could use a pair with a shorter inseam) I still buy men's hunting clothing. I am more for workablility/function than for fashion.

[duckdog]

GSG,
I just went back to that website to have a look around. Now I feel jipped. They have a video of the women in the night attire looking all sexy in front of the fireplace.......So I went to the men's gifts and......NO VIDEO OF MEN! That's just not fair. I was hoping to see a sexy man wearing maybe camo hip waders, in camo briefs, with no shirt on...That's lame!

Ok, I do have to confess. I do own a pair of Max 4 lounge pants with matching top. Annnd the women's camo gown in Max 4. I bought them from Cabela's. They are very comfortable....But I draw the line on the thong thingy......

[Gunslingergirl]

I'm with you duckdog, where are all the cheesecake photos of the men? I want to see them posing in their camo boxers.

I'm not saying that I wouldn't buy camo p.j's or even a camo underwear, but I don't think those really qualify as "hunting gifts".

I guess it just annoys me that the attitude seemed to be men do the hunting and women wear camo to look pretty for the men. Not that there's anything wrong with looking pretty for your man or, for that matter, your man looking handsome for you, I just think we need to acknowledge that, when it comes to hunting, women can do a lot more than just look pretty.

[Speckmisser]

I just think we need to acknowledge that, when it comes to hunting, women can do a lot more than just look pretty.

And, thankfully, that's just what folks like you and Holly are doing with your blogs and websites, and what women like Dana are doing by working to introduce new women to the sport, and encouraging them to stay involved.

It's a slow process, because the fact is that us men ARE generally chauvinistic and somewhat porcine...at least in groups. There are generations of gender-role learning to be undone, and I'm sure it's even tougher when us guys simply don't even understand what bugs you... much less why it bugs you.

[Gunslingergirl]

QUOTE (Speckmisser @ Dec 14 2007, 07:32 PM)
I just think we need to acknowledge that, when it comes to hunting, women can do a lot more than just look pretty.


And, thankfully, that's just what folks like you and Holly are doing with your blogs and websites, and what women like Dana are doing by working to introduce new women to the sport, and encouraging them to stay involved.

It's a slow process, because the fact is that us men ARE generally chauvinistic and somewhat porcine...at least in groups. There are generations of gender-role learning to be undone, and I'm sure it's even tougher when us guys simply don't even understand what bugs you... much less why it bugs you.


I think, as more women get involved in hunting and other outdoor sports, attitudes will start to change. There are definitely more women writing about hunting than I knew were doing so. I think that's a great thing.

As for the gender role expectations, I think there will always be men who think women shouldn't hunt, or that they aren't tough enough to hunt. There are a lot of other men, however, many of them here on this forum, who have been nothing but welcoming and supportive. My guess is that the need for more hunters is going to outweigh any residual expectation that all new hunters be male.

I also think, as women hunters grow in numbers, they'll also be more able to influence things with the dollars they spend, and we'll see less of the sales pitch that I pointed out at the beginning of this post. Holly has a great post Women Hunters and The Pocketbook (http://norcalcazadora.blogspot.com/2007/12/women-hunters-and-pocketbook.html) which explores this idea in more detail.

[Speckmisser]

Just gonna offer some food for thought, because I can no more claim to speak for "all" men than I can for any women.

But...


As for the gender role expectations, I think there will always be men who think women shouldn't hunt, or that they aren't tough enough to hunt. There are a lot of other men, however, many of them here on this forum, who have been nothing but welcoming and supportive. My guess is that the need for more hunters is going to outweigh any residual expectation that all new hunters be male.

I know there are probably a minority of guys who don't want to see women in the field, but I honestly think that most guys just don't know WHAT to think about women hunting or how to act when you're there. There's what I think is your biggest source of "tension" in the issue.

It's a whole new piece to the picture, and it's got to do with a lot more than just the "barefoot and pregnant in the kitchen" stereotype. I mean, really, it changes everything right down to where we pee. It's not that we don't want to change, but we're not sure exactly what or how to change.

[ltdann]

Ok, saw the website. Read the comments. Here's what I see.... a business opportunity. "Hunting gear for women, by women"

Anything designed by women ought to be better than that website and more practical than say, SHE safari junk.

Its a thought.

[ranchwife]

Based on the number of male responses to this thread, I can conclude that the site reached it's target audience - the men, not the women. I agree with going to Cabela's for hunting clothing for women - they are continually getting more products designed especiall for women who hunt/fish. Cabela's seems to take women in the outdoors seriously and see us as a potential source of revenue. Those that own the other site see women as hunter's toys and are still marketing to men.

[Jean]

So far, Cabelas' has done the best I've seen in marketing to women who hunt. As far as the website in question goes:

Try to waste as little time as you can on them and go hunting as much as you can.

Jean

[Gunslingergirl]

QUOTE (ltdann @ Dec 17 2007, 01:07 PM)
Ok, saw the website. Read the comments. Here's what I see.... a business opportunity. "Hunting gear for women, by women"

Anything designed by women ought to be better than that website and more practical than say, SHE safari junk.

Its a thought.

ltdann,

It is indeed a thought. One I've considered a time or two. I think the first company who figures out how to do gear for women who do all types of hunting will probably do very well.

GSG

[Gunslingergirl]

QUOTE (Speckmisser @ Dec 17 2007, 12:14 PM)
I know there are probably a minority of guys who don't want to see women in the field, but I honestly think that most guys just don't know WHAT to think about women hunting or how to act when you're there. There's what I think is your biggest source of "tension" in the issue.

It's a whole new piece to the picture, and it's got to do with a lot more than just the "barefoot and pregnant in the kitchen" stereotype. I mean, really, it changes everything right down to where we pee. It's not that we don't want to change, but we're not sure exactly what or how to change.

I think you may be right about that.

Men tend to act differently when it is just men, just as women tend to act a bit differently when with a group that is all women. I don't think it necessarily needs to be awkward though. It is just a matter of learning how to be together under the particular circumstances that hunting can impose. I'd guess the biggest thing needed to make this work is honesty on both sides.

Women have to speak up for themselves and let men know what they're comfortable with and what they expect. Men have to do the same. If both sides are willing to work at having a good hunt, I'm guessing everyone will have a good hunt.

[Speckmisser]

Well, after seeing Mudwalker come back, I'm a little surprised she hasn't posted on this one. This is one of the things that really seems to get her going sometimes.

Just a couple more things from me on this one.

First, as to the sites (especially smaller businesses) targeting ads to men... well, that's not likely to change and actually makes real good sense. Men are still 99% of the hunting population, and sex sells. Marketing 101. I'm not gonna say it's right or wrong, but it is what it is.

Next, I agree totally with Jean. Waste as little time on them and go hunting! The other twist on that is to vote with your wallets... and let the businesses know why, when you choose to pass them by.

Finally, Kristine... I actually I agree with you totally. I'm definitely supportive of more women getting into hunting, and while I point out the difficulties, it's not because I think they're insurmountable. I know for a fact otherwise... it just takes some adjustment. I think it's important for both genders to recognize that the adjustment is needed, and to help each other work through it.

[mudwalker]

You know, I almost posted last night when I read through this, and then I realized... I have said all I am going to say about this a couple of years ago. There are men that understand it from our side and those that just never will. So be it.

So I am not going to say anything else... other than of course they were targeting men with that ad. Why else would they put such a small bikini on a model that so obviously needed one at least two sizes larger.

[duckdog]

QUOTE (mudwalker @ Dec 18 2007, 03:10 PM)
So I am not going to say anything else... other than of course they were targeting men with that ad. Why else would they put such a small bikini on a model that so obviously needed one at least two sizes larger.

LOL..............You got that right Kat!

[Gunslingergirl]

I have to agree with both Kat and Dana. The women in those pictures were obviously dressed and posed to illict a specific reaction. Which, isn't necessarily wrong. I just think the page was mislabeled.

[Gunslingergirl]

QUOTE (Speckmisser @ Dec 18 2007, 12:35 PM)
First, as to the sites (especially smaller businesses) targeting ads to men... well, that's not likely to change and actually makes real good sense. Men are still 99% of the hunting population, and sex sells. Marketing 101. I'm not gonna say it's right or wrong, but it is what it is.

Next, I agree totally with Jean. Waste as little time on them and go hunting! The other twist on that is to vote with your wallets... and let the businesses know why, when you choose to pass them by.

Finally, Kristine... I actually I agree with you totally. I'm definitely supportive of more women getting into hunting, and while I point out the difficulties, it's not because I think they're insurmountable. I know for a fact otherwise... it just takes some adjustment. I think it's important for both genders to recognize that the adjustment is needed, and to help each other work through it.

I think you're right on all three points here.

I'm in Marketing, so I know you market to the audience that has the largest wallet. Right now, when it comes to hunting, that's men. As women start exercising more of their economic power, that will change.

I also agree that the best revenge is to go out and hunt and to spend your money with sites, companies and stores that support women who hunt. Like all hunters, female hunters need to unite to make their voices heard. The best way to get a for profit company to change the way they do business is to hit them in the bank balance.

As to a third point, I know you, and a lot of men on this site and that I have met elsewhere are supportive of women who hunt and eager to introduce more women to hunting. I think willingness on both sides is the most necessary thing. Everything else can be worked out.